Wine & Food

Snooth User: bostonlobsterman

Need a wine for this birdie

Original post by bostonlobsterman, Oct 23, 2016.

Replies

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Reply by vin0vin0, Nov 3, 2016.

BLM, was that pheasant heart a bit gamey or more subtle? If somewhat earthy, then this Bedrock would we had would pair nicely. Big and bold with loads of dark ripe fruit, this is not a shy syrah. Layers of ripe black cherry, licorice, tar, leather, and a bit of smoke are balanced with lively acidity and a somewhat creamy mouthfeel. The nose has blueberry and just a hint of game, the finish is long.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 3, 2016.

Vino, the primary lingering flavor was definitely Earthy, with a gamey touch. Good call. will try next time.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 3, 2016.

Did my pheasant pic disappear? Can't see it now. The last 2.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 4, 2016.

I shot my Thanksgiving bird this morning. Going to be looking for a wine to go with it. 

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Reply by JonDerry, Nov 4, 2016.

Clos de la Roche, or Bonne Mares?

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 4, 2016.

JD tkx for these excellent suggestions. This bird is begging for a complex burgundy. 

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Reply by Richard Foxall, Nov 4, 2016.

With birds of all sorts, I like cab franc.  Unless it's duck, then it's a bigger pinot or St. Joseph.  Hearts are chewy--my mother used to fry them up all the time--and with chewy things I want some acid to break it down, which is why I would lean toward St. Joseph with fowl heart.  But, wow, this is all very specific.  Grab something you like and go with it.  I think the preparation is also a big factor, and can imagine riesling with many preparations. 

Tonight we'll have a more pedestrian roast chicken, and we'll definitely start with Champagne, but then we're moving onto a 2010 Hirsch San Andreas.  Probably.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 4, 2016.

Starting with Champagne, YES!  :)  Nothing can go wrong from there.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 4, 2016.

Fox, heart can be melt in your mouth tender. Promise.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 4, 2016.

Lots of pheasant on my plate lately. Decided to wing left overs into a pheasant omelette. My first. Superb. Served with a  nice Crémant de Bourgogne

 

 

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Reply by dmcker, Nov 5, 2016.

Over here when you buy chicken livers you get the hearts. As expected with a commercial product that's not kill-fresh, they can be tough. I end up using them separately from the livers, usually chopping them and throwing them in a bolognese, or something similar a la Indienne (Keema, etc.) or even some Chinese stirfry (when I first traveled outside the big cities in China back when, you'd be asked if you wanted meat in the dish you had ordered; depending on where you were it could get pretty rough, and end up being cock's combs or feet or the like in backcountry Sichuan, for example--thus stirfries can contain just about anything...). Fresh killed game is completely different, of course. With venison, the liver is probably the best part. On longer trips involving camping out, would often have it for breakfast if return was after dark and the animal was cleaned under lights, with some other dinner already prepared by someone else--otherwise would've been for dinner if return was earlier. A fresh venison liver is nothing like even calve's liver on the commercial market, much less any other four-legged animal's.

So no surprise about the pheasant's heart.

How big is that turkey? Never have hunted them properly, though have shot farmed animals with a .22 from a distance to avoid getting any fear products into the meat.

This all takes me back, that's for sure.

That's a big syrah for pheasant I would think, Vino, though as Fox says just try anything you think you might like and there may be some pleasant surprises...

BLM is that a Browning with the pheasants? Yours? And what's with the scope for the turkey--shooting slugs??

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 5, 2016.

That turkey is about 18 lbs, a younger bird. The big ones around here are in the mid to upper 20s. One had to be euthanized this past year for attacking a mailman. Yes indeed the pheasant gun is a Browning Auto 5, a 1961 Belgium (super year for bordeaux btw). The scope on the turkey gun is to be able to take a longer shot. The birds are tough needing a pretty good shot placement to take them down.  I use no 4 shot. 

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Reply by dmcker, Nov 6, 2016.

Just old pioneer/farming/ranching stock where I came from so nothing as fancy as a Browning Auto, at least on my dad's side. Beautiful gun, though, and have heard no complaints about its functioning (see below).

My mom's dad did use a Mannlicher for hunting deer, and since I was out of the country my brother got that gun when he passed. I was happy with my old Model 12 Winchester pump and WWI era 30-06 bolt action after I graduated from a hand-me-down Krag of even earlier vintage--at least I didn't have to use my great grandfather's Spencer. Only auto I ever used at that time was a .22, and it was remarkably accurate. My dad played around with a number of Winchester deer guns and Remington shotguns, but their automatic of that era was a dog.

I've heard tell of people hunting turkey with solid slugs (or rifles)--is that at all common? No. 4 shot sounds smaller than many use for geese (I used to use no. 2). How long your shells? What type of pellets?

You ever drink anything other than Burg with your turkey? If I had a dozen birds, PN would probably be the main choice twice. For whatever reason it's become the conventional wisdom on wine boards in recent years, and I'm not totally in agreement. A 'complex Burgundy' requires a lot of attention to itself, and also reacts differently to more complex sauces, including those that are wine based, which is not what you're getting at a traditional Thanksgiving dinner. Plain turkey meat, gravy, cranberries, yams, and highly herbed stuffings don't give me what I want when I'm drilling down on that Burg. New World PNs are simpler, blunter instruments, perhaps, and I have liked Soter's pink sparkling from Oregon with that bird...

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Reply by JonDerry, Nov 6, 2016.

If we're talking Thanksgiving specific, it's a good Cru Beajolais, like Morgon, Fleurie or some such. Does very well with the turkey itself and stands up to Cranberry, etc. I should try some new world Pinot and Blanc de Noirs as well this year, it's been a while.

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 6, 2016.

DMC- the Win 12 is an outstanding shotgun! Never heard of slugs for turkey. Reason is would ruin the bird. The largest shot allowed in MA for turkey is no. 4. I think part of idea is to reduce chances of someone being able to poach another animal out of season while turkey hunting. Aim high for the head and neck to keep BBs out of the meat. A lot if my friends like to use no 5 or even no 6 to get a denser pattern. I use 3 inch magnum ordinary lead loads which are allowed here if not shooting over water (ducks). Some people use 31/2 inch shells, a modern trend. It entices you to buy the latest gun. I like the old ones. 

Now to the point here, wine:  I think the PN is very well suited to venison. The meat on a wild turkey is a lot darker- even the breast- than on a domestic. It also takes much more care in cooking to not be tough. Most of the breast meat I marinate for 2 days and turn into jerky- incredibly tasty- while the rest goes into a slow cooker. This holiday bird is going to be cooked whole, either braised or smoked or a combination of both. In any case slow cooking at low temp for a long time and kept moist. I have been most often been drinking Rhone with the big birds, a good excuse to open a CNduP. Of consideration, as you say, is what else is served with it?  I tend to eat simpler meals. Meat, white spuds, stuffing, and a green veggie would fill my thanksgiving plate. This makes it easier to match a red. The gravy, however, is a wild card on the palate. If I made it I would use red wine of the same grape and problem would be solved. 

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 6, 2016.

JD-  Yes!!! Thanks for reminding me that I love Cru Beaujolais. Used to drink them more when they were dirt cheap. 1983 was an outstanding year and those lasted for several years. My only problem is that when I find them here they are often expensive enough so that I have a lot of other choices. Let's face it, a wine like that while perfectly good in the right setting should be under $10 and be at least 2 years old. 

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Reply by JonDerry, Nov 6, 2016.

Try Clos de Roilette BLM, I think their Fleurie is under $20, and their top cuvée, the Tardive is under $30

I heard that Cru Beajolais was more expensive than any Burgundy 100 years ago. I wonder what happened there? 

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Reply by bostonlobsterman, Nov 6, 2016.

Could it be that Beaujolais Nouveau gave it a bad name? We used to have one sip for fun then break out something else.

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Reply by dmcker, Nov 7, 2016.

BLM, I was basically wondering about distance of shots, and I think the stories of solid bullet hunting for turkeys were probably driven by overweening pride in accuracy by the speaker, though if you could find a bird at rest downrange at some distance it seemed to make sense. Talk was of not hitting them center mass, but like when I was using the .22 for farmed animal harvesting, going for the head. I was imagining the guffaws one or two of the stories might induce in certain groups of hunting aficionados...

Beaujolais is basically the closest thing to Burg that's not PN. Really hit and miss in what's available on the market, though, unless you're in France. I was drinking there from the late ''70s and nouveau was a different animal then. Later ('80s and '90s) found Rodet's to be the best generally available in the marketplace. Haven't bought any from anybody in over a decade. Was still cheap in the '70s and early '80s but became an absurd fad after that as everybody pushed whatever juice they could to meet demand. Obviously the crus are a different story. Outside France in various markets I've found Jean-Paul Thévenet's Morgon to be a reliable go-to.

Have had Beaulolais at table at Thanksgiving a couple of times, but never perceived any groundswell of demand to repeat.

 

 

 

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Reply by JonDerry, Nov 7, 2016.

What did you think of Cauble's Thanksgiving 6-pack?

What other wines would you include?



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